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MM23: Through A Glass Darkly - Simulated Realities of Mamoru Oshii feat. Felix Biederman

🕑 Added 2024-06-05 11:00:14 +0000 UTC

Comments

Eamon Short

Real recognises real

Shawn Dempsey

Why won’t this episode play?

Cardboard

I keep returning to this ep months later. The theme of loss of faith is resonant with me on the left, as the world is gets worse. The 1 Corinthians 13:11 verse cited by the hosts effected me deeply. For me, childish thoughts was idealism/moralism and thinking like an adult is historical materialism and engaging with the world as it exists. I miss Michael Brooks' view on left spirituality, it's sorely needed in these dark times

Taz

I would love a whole run of the mindset view of anime movies

kee

"Writing about music is like dancing about architecture" -Frank Zappa

Adam Foster

I wouldn’t agree that “Akira” is nihilistic, I think perhaps the movie can be read that way but certainly not if you have the context of the manga. Without the manga I agree that nihilism is a valid potential take-away. In the manga Akira is clearly (and all but explicitly) a buddhist story about how we exist in a never ending cycle of destruction and creation, each leading to the other. Oshii may not have become a priest in the end but I feel like his Christian background may have influenced his reaction to Akira on some level, because Akira isn’t saying destruction is good (and in the manga there are several explosions and people keep on living) it’s saying destruction is just a thing that happens and that we all react differently when we face it. As much as Japan is influenced by the bomb and the destruction of WWII we’re talking about a country where you lose count of the earthquake warnings and how many things of yours have been broken by earthquakes. I think the mindset that destruction can bring something positive is maybe necessary in a place like that just to get by day-to-day.

Pantato

i didnt know you guys covered actual good content

Cardboard

This was my first MM episode, great ep everyone

江戸ねビル

Best movie mindset TO DATE!

kallampero

James Cameron called Oshii's Avalon (2001) "the most artistic, beautiful and stylish [film] in Science Fiction history"

Kevin Spicer

Thank you so much, was crying in the car listening to this.

Kevin Spicer

Really wanna see these. Thanks for this.

Michael Austin

anyone who dogs angels egg should check out texhnolyze or chiaki j konaka in general

Ricardo

You dont have to watch patlabor 1. They're standalone tbh. First one is good but its def more mecha based then the second one.

Chris T

Should I watch Patlabor 1 before 2?

leeythe

One quote I’ve heard before and still find intriguing is “Koreans got what Japan deserved (as punishment).” I hope I get to listen to discussion involving films like The Host (Bong one) or Joint Security Area, which touch on themes like Korea-US relation or longstanding division of Korea, someday.

PenjaminFranklin

Ofc Felix gets invited to weeb appreciation day

Regular guy

So Angel's Egg is literally "Can I offer you an egg in these trying times"

luffa

i was so excited for this one. shout out to action channel for exposing kid me to all the patlabor movies.

Chris

This was great y’all thought of these movies in ways I hadn’t thought of or hadn’t noticed. The thing hesse said about the jug not looking full despite being full is like if the jug is submerged in water was an interesting thought. Really enjoyed watching these movies

etienne

soooo is Time For My Stories going to be reissued or do i need to keep skimming it in semi complete form from youtube channels named like The Covfefe Chronicles

Thankyou For Reading Out My Name In This Accent

That's okay, Hesse wasn't listening to fucking anyone.

Jones Kolbinsky

That quote about dancing for architecture Hessa mentioned was by Frank Zappa

auf die Welle

I appreciate the shout out to Shin Godzilla -- really a perfect film. Great episode.

江戸ねビル

YES YES YES YES FUCK YES THANK YOU FOR THIS EPISODE

Nicholas Needham

Delighted to see Oshii’s work get much deserved recognition AND for Felix to get on movie mindset. Love the episode everyone

etienne

and then some guy committed an act of Aggression-Style Pacifism by doming his ass with the Gadgetron 3000 Deluxe right? I guess it was more about the moonies but still

Dylan

Regarding the seminary thing: I remember reading somewhere he thought about going when he was young but later realized he just liked the christian mythology and biblical imagery and was glad to not have gone. He’s apparently a fan of the stories and themes of the bible and rereads it often but doesn’t consider himself religious.

Last Years Man

Will: Even weirder than calling them the self-defense forces was what happened when Abe was trying to amend the constitution in recent years. He claimed that Japan would still be a pacifist nation, even if it had the right to attack enemy territory, because they would be engaging in "pro-active pacifism" (積極的平和主義）

Last Years Man

Oops, just heard WIll make the exact same point.

Last Years Man

Re: the god destroying the world thing in Angel's Egg, I sort of had the sense that things paused after the floods and it wasn't necessarily God that did so - that humanity was supposed to start over but was afraid. So things are kind of in stasis until they finally break the egg, which is where all the forces of creation were trapped inside.

Last Years Man

One of the best parts about Patlabor 2 is how realistic its portrayal of Tokyo is. It's easy to forget this is sci-fi about giant robots, because the way infrastructure is portrayed is 100% accurate to the time. It's not just that the Rainbow Bridge is real, as are a lot of the shots of narrow streets covered with signs. It's also the way the infrastructure functions in Tokyo and what would happen in a city that spread out and densely crowded if all forms of transportation were suddenly cut off. You'd be completely stranded and at the mercy of whatever military force was pouring down on you, just like you see in the story.

Randy

I fucking loved this

K H

Interesting read of Madoka Magica. I only ever interpreted it as some weird expression on the futility of resisting the Dao or Samsara. Weird. That makes it much more on the nose and I am also not sure what to make of it.

Wildly Absurd

Will understands trans women are women that’s why he wasn’t listening when Hesse was talking about the Bible

K H

The thing about the vessel already being full because they are submerged in some way is wild. Like...bruh? 🤯

jack

just want hesse to know we recognized when will didn’t listen and repeated what you just said

Peen Israel

This was a slog

Christopher E Musgrave

Alex Jones grew up in an exurb of Goblintown

buttface

Movies are boring

Sam

I also thought that the ark looked like a seed at the end. When the boy talks about the tree of life, he talks about how it grew out of nothing as if to grab something. The ark in the nothingness reminded me of that.

Bob Chappell

see a lot of Patlabor in the Front Mission games

Dick Van Sexel

Another good animated episode would be the hobbit and the last unicorn

Sam

Also in the first scene the hand is not just turning, it is acting as though it is interacting with an egg. First turns it around, then cradles it, then crushes it in the grasp.

Sam

The Adam and Eve reading is very interesting. I also want to add, if you have seen Madoka Magica, or any magical girl anime, you won't be stranger to the concept; but there is, in many of these genres as well as Angel's Egg, a motif of "end of girlhood" as death. Kumiko Saito has written about it in an essay called "Magic, Shōjo , and Metamorphosis": womanhood as erasure of identity and a flattening into an image of a "mother" archetype can be seen in many of these animes. In magical girl animes it usually manifests as the loss of the magical power into the maturity, most of the time as a sacrifice for others. In madoka magica, every magical girl is doomed to turning into a witch, which is the monsters they fight throughout the entire show. The metamorphosis happens when the hope that fuels girlhood runs out. When I saw Angel's Egg, I thought of this. Especially in the death scene. Her behaviour is childish most of the time, too trusting of this man that eventually breaks into the egg as she is asleep in the pedestal. When she falls into the water, she has a kiss of death before she is fully submerged. When she is in the water, for the first time she is drawn with a mature body, caressing her hand across her body. She is drowning, but her reaction is orgasmic. This is a very weird motif that once you start seeing you cannot unsee in many japanese media. Loss of innocence and girlhood being equated to losing life and personality in some cases. It is puritanical in a non-american way, so I sometimes am not sure what to make of it.

Christopher E Musgrave

Hey now

Zach G

also - Hesse said that Oshii only directed two live-action movies but he's made like 10+

brodie

Other insane Aum Shinrikyo thing is the theory that they accidentally set off a low yield nuclear bomb in the Australian outback. I think trueanon mentioned it in an ep randomly.

Smooth Shrek

DO SHREK YOU COWARDS

NLC

There's actually been some controversy over the statement that Oshii went to seminary, a Japanese user on twitter feels that it was a mistranslation because he never saw reference to it in any Japanese sources but sees it all over the place in English language ones: https://x.com/htGOIW/status/1604041254937202688

Zach G

Gotta send a big thank you to you guys - I've never so quickly become a fan of a director, but Oshii is dope as hell. I'm already planning on watching his other stuff, starting with the Red Spectacles + sequels

Zach G

I like both which is why I am now downloading the entire 1980s anime series like a true psycho

Zach G

FYI These are both on internet archive. (You can find other copies on there also if these aren't up to snuff) https://archive.org/download/angels-egg-1985-blu-ray-1080p-jap-audio/ https://archive.org/download/patlabor-2-the-movie-1993-original-dolby-stereo-mix

NYCM&AHole

The first half was way too serious for Chapo.

emalco

Beyond the fact that movies are one of the best things to podcast about, it’s really enjoyable to listen to the hosts talk about art that they sincerely like and find profound. It’s nice to hear their analytic skills be put to use by discussing artists who produce something important and insightful. A nice break from unpacking the endless churn of horrid, vapid opinion pieces and tweets.

Porpoise

Awesome episode! I love the angels egg segment. I thought that the terracotta army are people who have achieved nirvana or some similar faith based state. when we see the girl there with them I believe that we are meant to assume that her faith has been rewarded and she has been granted a place among the faithful. and considering that we saw statues reanimate in the movie she may have something resembling life in her future.

Zachariah Fyre

Angel egg is on YouTube. Zax solidarity

Miles_B

Great stuff!

Zack Burke

Can you guys point us to where you found these to view?

Harper Big Spender Karabees

pemis

Samuel McGuire

Well this is good news. https://deadline.com/2024/05/mamoru-oshii-4k-remastering-1985-animation-angels-egg-gebeka-international-cannes-1235910631/amp/

Chapo Trap House

check out the most recent Blank Check miniseries, they just did Satoshi Kon, it's good.

Evan Pitkin

Is Ghost in the Shell too mainstream for you fucking hipsters?

June K

Been waiting for this one ever since it was announced

The True Horror

Oh hell yeah

John Swan

You can find an English sub of Angel’s Egg pretty reliably on YouTube. Patlabor 2 otoh is only intermittently available for streaming in any service YT or otherwise and looks like it’s only available on DVD rn

John Swan

Skill issue

godheks

where can we watch these movies? i absolutely love movie mindset and look forward to every new episode. my only critique would be sharing with us, your adoring audience, where we might be able to stream said movies in each new ep. thanks team! please keep up the good work of re-enchanting life by adopting a movie mindset.

Lucas Kahn

Talking about art is like dancing about architecture. -Thelonius Monk!

Blank

Felix who?

etienne

this is like one of those opinions that children form right after that phase of development where they try out having an individuality

D

Why is everyone doing these movie podcasts now, who seriously gives a fuck about these movies

JD Nonce

I’ve been living in Japan two years and counting and I’m still baffled by the political and cultural landscape caused by the 90s

Justin Racine

Weeb episode and Felix collab? Fuck Yeah!!!

Michael B. Jordan B. Peterson

Crossover episode!

Asher

Seems like they're not streaming... To the torrents!

Enoch

Felix watch 1994 anime film Pom Poko

waterbird

angels egg is so fucking pretentious and unwatchable. patlabor 2 goes crazy tho

Kyle Cassidy

I am a true sicko who prefers Patlabor 1 to Patlabor 2. I respect the chilling martial law montage, the frustrated romantic tension between Shinobu and the bad guy, etc., but I much prefer the "goofy guys in serious trouble" tone of the first to the unleavened bleakness of the second.

LandonVanBus

Season 3 needs to have a Felix Michael Haneke episode!

etienne

I had a fun experience watching Ghost in the Shell, i had seen it a while ago and had a great memory of it and great expectations and sat down to watch with a friend and by halfway the movie had sailed clean past my expectations, i was just astonished. clean 10/10 no notes