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The Nature of Predators 2-10
🕑 Added 2024-02-08 12:00:08 +0000 UTCMemory Transcription Subject: Tassi, Bissem Scientist
Date [standardized human time]: March 17, 2160
The spaceport appeared to be in the middle of several sprawling complexes, many of which were adorned with starkly different vegetation and were manned by guards of unique species. I took a moment to soak in as many of the beings as I could, recognizing that these were Sapient Coalition members; the décor on their embassies must be representative of their homeworld. What Naltor and I were gazing at was a snapshot of hundreds of worlds! Embassy Row was situated in the center of the city, replacing buildings that had stood there before. Further out from the unyielding street, and the surrounding diplomatic structures, was a city—with numerous humans bustling about.
How complex and unique each of them must be, every single one with a story to tell like Dustin! These aliens were just going about their lives, paying little mind to how many offworlders surrounded them. If this many sapient species had set up shop in Lassmin, I’d spend every day touring embassies, and talking with the staff: learning the nuances of their homes and cultures. They wouldn’t be able to get rid of me. With us landing in this diplomatic berth, I might have the opportunity to start making the rounds on Earth. This was my opportunity to discover as much information as possible…and to plan for our official introduction.
This is the first time many in the galaxy will see a Bissem, so it’s important to put a friendly flipper forward. I can see cameras waiting outside the docking port, though they’ve been kept back a ways.
“Naltor? Friendly talk only. I’ll handle this.” I scampered toward the exit as soon as the clamps fastened to the ship’s underside, and tried to calm my nerves. What if I said the wrong thing, compared to how Dustin had played the Bissem crowds like a flipperpad? The doors swung open, with Nulia aiding my escape, and I found myself blurting out the first thing on my mind. “Hi, humans. Your planet is…lovely! We’re delighted to be here, and to see everything you have to offer. We can learn so much from you, with your commitment to such a beautiful cause. It’s so nice to meet you, and…I can’t wait for the opportunity to meet every species!”
Naltor trudged out after me, looking uneasy at the crowd of aliens behind the barricades. “Um…how do you do? How many people are watching this?”
“Across all platforms and all planets? Twenty billion,” a human reporter answered.
“By Hirs, that is way too many eyes on us. I’m not sure we’re, um, prepared to make a statement.”
I raised my beak, feigning confidence. “It seems we have twenty billion friends out there already. That warms my heart…to know despite all of the aliens you’ve discovered, you’ll show the same interest in us that I feel about you. I’ve heard first contact is new to the Sapient Coalition, and obviously, this is my first skid across the ice too. We’re similar in a lot of ways, but I’m elated to figure out where we differ as well. Whatever happens, I promise that Bissems will work toward a place for ourselves in the galaxy.”
Haliska trotted out with twitching whiskers. “The Bissems will prepare their full statement for the official SC meeting, but we knew you wanted to film this moment. It’s obviously massive news for them, so we ask for some space and courtesy as they’re introduced to a vast many things!”
“Yes, it’s been quite the whirlwind, I imagine,” Dustin chuckled. “There’s plenty of people on Earth who know exactly how they feel. At the least, I hope we can be more welcoming and charitable than the Federation.”
“From what I know, that sounds like a low bar to clear,” Naltor grumbled.
“Ahem. I quite agree, but perhaps let’s not discuss this further here? Come along. We have to get scanned before the tour…it was part of our agreement.”
Scanned?
I spread my flippers out like a proper wingspan, trying to signal my positive intentions to the cameras. Several of the humans’ eyes widened in a strange, patronizing way, which I couldn’t interpret through my minimal knowledge of their body language. To dub it as “patronizing” could be applying my own filter to them, given how we misinterpreted their teeth baring as a threat display. Perhaps my nonverbal gesture meant something else to them? It might not have been wise to use a Bissem cue for friendliness in “open flippers.” I rubbed a flipper against my beak, feeling a bit mollified at my lack of judgment. Hopefully, that lapse wouldn’t come back to haunt me.
“What do you mean by scanned?” Naltor hissed. “Like a medical scan? I thought you said you couldn’t pass contagions to us!”
Dustin raised a placating hand. “We can’t. I don’t know how to say this, but in essence, we’re getting our brains scanned. From that data, our people can document how first contact went—without us having to film or write down any mission logs.”
“Back the fuck up. You can read minds?!”
“We can interpret the brain’s encoding of memories, Naltor. To know what you’re thinking right now, or to have any untoward influences on those thoughts, is another matter altogether. Artificial intelligence has come a long way from being able to pick out single images from our mind’s eye, but it’s a field of study we’ve been pursuing for over a century.”
“You can figure out what I’m thinking now, as soon as it’s in the past, by looking into my brain. Why would you give yourself the ability to do that?”
“Naltor, I don’t think you have a right to judge them. As unnerving as the prospect is, they have…sophisticated technology,” I commented, though I was apprehensive about my every thought being easily accessible. “It sounds like they’re doing it for historical documentation purposes.”
“That means there is zero privacy, to the very core of your consciousness. There must be things people don’t want the world to know. What right does anyone have to judge you for feelings you have no control over, and to expose your innermost thoughts? Why does nobody have moral qualms about this?”
Nulia waggled a claw. “Of course we do. The technology raised many ethical controversies and spawned a multitude of laws. However, there were many other concerns that made it worth pursuing. All brain scans of living individuals are completely voluntary, and even postmortem, we’ve put rights in place.”
“It’s logical to ask, ‘Just because we can, does that mean we should?’” Dustin turned to face Naltor, with his lips curving downward into a grimace. “You asked why, General, so let me rattle off a few reasons. You know how the Federation wiped anything predatory from a species’ history?”
“In something you might sympathize with, more than anyone, that included our natural drive to be in the water,” Haliska whispered. “They let our homeworld die because we liked to swim. Even if you weren’t carnivores, they would’ve hated you for that.”
“No more. I don’t want them to feel like there’s anything wrong with them, Hallie. The Federation were sick bastards. My point is that a lot of authentic history was lost, because some alien hotshots decided which parts of a species’ culture they could keep. Project Chronicle was what really poured research into these transcripts, because they were trying to piece together missing info. With anyone we have brain data on, we can cobble back information from the past: a biological, first-person source. Just as we are for your first contact.”
“Just slow down for a minute, please. I can’t hear myself think.” I felt my eyes water, as I tried to process everything I’d just heard; that AI could recreate entire lives from a brain scan, and that the Thafki had been left to die for swimming. How exactly was that predatory at all? “There’s so much I don’t understand about your past.”
“And does understanding history really make it worth violating people’s minds?” Naltor squawked. “Is that single reason good enough for such a personal procedure?”
Nulia chuckled. “If you want to know for certain we harbor no ill will, or evil master plans, Naltor…you’re welcome to read our transcripts. Though I imagine Dustin’s has a few intrusive thoughts about how adorable you are.”
“Don’t call me out like that! I would never say it aloud; it’s especially bad for me, since I’m obsessed with all kinds of animals,” the human grumbled. “Scans will be mandatory for us to undergo on a regular basis, due to our importance to the program. If you’d like to contribute, you’re welcome to, but nobody will force you. Should you receive a transcript, you’ll have full say over what to exclude.”
“With respect, I don’t feel comfortable with the entire world knowing my thoughts. Seeing through my eyes,” I answered.
“Of course. I’m only offering it, if you ever want to document your experiences for posterity. Before Naltor demands more reasons for its existence, I promise, there are some major gains to be had from this. Imagine if you get into an accident, and you lose your memories…or you have a memory-loss disease. These transcripts are a backup. They’re a tool into better understanding consciousness, and the brain; treating any dysfunction.”
“Remember Slanek, Doctor Tassi? The Federation captured him and tampered with his short-term memory. But there was an old transcript of him, made from a brain scan their scientists did to help destroy his mind,” Nulia commented. “Tech like this could’ve…restored a version from years ago, if the brain functionality was still there. Marcel—my adoptive father—mentioned trying that, before he went off the grid. It’d be top-secret if they did, I guess. I at least…hope that’s where they vanished to.”
Haliska placed her tail on Nulia’s wrist. “It’s a nice thought. I like the idea that, if I died today, there’d be something left of me. Maybe even a way to bring me back, eventually. This can’t be the end; I can’t just be gone forever, when there’s so many things I wished I did.”
“Are you seriously saying this could be used to bring people back from the dead?!” Naltor exclaimed.
“It can’t right now, but maybe one day, soon. We are our thoughts, like you said. I know if I could have one more moment with my loved ones, in any capacity, I would. My parents both drowned decades ago, trying to swim as far off-shore as they could: free from the Federation at last. They didn’t bank on how grueling it’d be to come back, and they didn’t have proper swim training. I like to think they died happy, being able to follow their hearts. I wish I could tell them about the things I’ve done. Just…talk.”
“We all have reasons we’re invested in preserving consciousness, for ourselves and others. This research could bring great advances for our societies,” Dustin finished, noticing that the Thafki was growing teary-eyed. “It’s a way to grasp things we could never experience for ourselves. What it feels like for a Duerten to fly, something I suspect Bissems would be interested in. What it’s like to be braindead, in a coma, or to die—nobody lives to tell that last one. What it’s like to experience schizophrenia, or the actual manifestations of dangerous thinking. Endless uses. Endless answers.”
The Selmer general looked stricken. “I’m still discomforted by the idea, but I must confess that some of those uses sound interesting to me. What a valuable interrogation asset it must be, as well.”
“And you just gave a reason why the Geneva Conventions—our warfare laws—probably need an update. Let us have our scans done, and we’ll move onto a more laid-back tour?”
Our posse had arrived in a secluded room, which had a metal basket with a few wires on the table: an unassuming device, for the insight its cursory overview would uncover. I watched with curious eyes, as each member of the first contact team placed it atop their craniums for a few seconds. Given how little hesitation there was, I imagined they’d done it before; having their thoughts dissected was normal to them. Would that ever be a decision that I would choose? Were my memories valuable enough to sacrifice my privacy, so that Bissems could see how our first steps into the stars played out? That was without even addressing my mixed emotions on reinstating my consciousness, beyond death or during life.
Haliska placed a paw on my shoulder. “That was it. Thanks for your patience, and for your tolerance of our…different standards of culture. How would you feel about a stroll down Embassy Row? I’m afraid the humans have sidewalks, not sideswims.”
“I figured as much. Whether humans love the ocean or not, they don’t seem born to swim.”
“You’d be surprised. We even have it as a sport; maybe we should’ve sent a swimmer, and not a xenobiologist, along for the landing party!” Dustin exclaimed. “C’mon. I know Tassi wants a peek at every species out there, before we show you to your accommodations.”
The human pranced out of the spaceport, teeth bared in jovial fashion. I turned my gaze upward, following him with my own childlike enthusiasm; I could feel the warm rays of an alien sun slapping the tan feathers on my face. As a Vritala, able to endure the most tropical weather, I appreciated that Vienna had a more temperate feel. The air had been crisp and breathable since we landed here, more like the known climate of Tseia Nomads’ homeland, Alsh. I couldn’t help myself, comparing every sensation to the world that I knew. What was there to measure my experiences by, except Ivrana? Earth was beautiful, but Ivrana was the very benchmark that influenced my judgments.
Nulia fell in beside me, as Naltor’s eyes darted around at each embassy. “The nearest embassies to the spaceport are the Key Species: starting with Earth’s original three allies, the Venlil, the Zurulians, and the Yotul. They spread out from there based on the order they opened diplomatic relations—so somewhat, you can argue it’s by importance. Some annexes you see are from outside the SC, whether it be from the Shield or from neutral parties.”
“There’s over 150 embassies here, so while I’m happy to walk you by all of them, it would be…a lot. We can just walk you through the most essential SC members and get your feet wet,” Dustin said. “How about we start with the Venlil? I lived with a Venlil family, on their world, for years, so it’s an easy one.”
“Are they going to oppose our entry?” Naltor blurted. “Are they a diplomatic threat?”
“Um, the Venlil shouldn’t be an issue. What you should know about them is that they're our neighbors. A highly emotional species, which sometimes correlates to aggression. The Federation didn’t like that, and crippled them. Yeah, Tassi, every time you hear the Federation in the past tense, just assume it’ll be something horrible. You’ll get used to it.”
I cleared my throat. “I’m sorry. It’s difficult to imagine why they would do that to innocent people. To an entire species.”
“Because they could,” Naltor sighed. “Why does any fiend do anything?”
“I can’t pretend to speak for the Federation, beyond them blaming a prion disease outbreak. The truth is, we’ll never know if it was more complicated than that.” Dustin breathed out a flustered sigh, rubbing the back of his neck. “My point is that, if the Venlil were willing to accept us, when nobody believed we were anything more than heartless predators, they’re actually a safe bet for being allies. They saved our species back then, they have significant sway with the SC, and they’ve been linked to us for a long time. Just don’t find a way to piss them off, or you might regret it.”
“Noted,” I replied.
Creatures with bushy, curly fur watched from behind the Venlil embassy’s gates, plodding forward to observe us with interest. Some of the older ones had crooked legs, compared to much hardier-looking, young specimens; their coloration was primarily shades of gray, with a few exceptions. I was going to part my flippers in the same gesture from earlier, but stopped after recalling the humans’ strange reaction. One of the aliens seemed to notice me, watching them all awkward and tensed up, and swayed his tail in a greeting. At a loss for what to do, I mirrored the motion with a flipper.
“On the other side of the street, the Zurulians! If—Protector forbid—anything happens to you, they’ll be the ones who patch you up. Famous for their compassion, and the medical innovations that sprang from their kindness,” Nulia explained. “Shortly after we discovered Bissems, their Galactic Institute of Medicine requested all the anatomical data and medical literature we could find on you. They wouldn’t want any lives at risk that could’ve been saved if they studied you in advance.”
Naltor’s eyes were narrowed with skepticism. “Those tiny quadrupeds? They’d be the ones stitching me up?”
“You’d be surprised how crafty they are, and their robotic aides fill in where they lack strength. You’d be in good paws,” Haliska replied.
Dustin hesitated at the embassy ahead, presumably the third from their Key Species list: the Yotul. “Right. Let’s not make any ruckus as we pass here. If you want a diplomatic threat, the Technocracy thinks we never should’ve contacted you. They’re mistrustful of new members to begin with, but with you being an ‘uplift’, I imagine they’ll oppose your entry in any way possible.”
“A species that was bullied mercilessly, but had power dumped in their lap during the war,” Nulia finished. “Now they’re a force to be reckoned with, and brimming with paranoia. They also have a habit of spying, so I imagine they can throw around some blackmail to sway votes, if talking doesn’t work.”
The Selmer general raised his flippers in exasperation. “Well, they sound like pleasant fellows. Tassi, you want to march up to the gates and say hello?”
“I actually don’t see how it could hurt to try to smooth things over. Just because these Yotul have decided to be our enemies, doesn’t mean we have to give it back,” I commented.
“They’re not your enemies. They think they’re doing you a favor,” Dustin sighed. “I don’t imagine they want to exchange pleasantries, Tassi, so I advise keeping your head down. No need to risk a vitriolic bout making the rounds on the web.”
I cast a brief glance at the building, which had green sand rooting down tropical-looking trees at the gates. Further back, there were small, tan animals bounding around in the grass, which seemed to have been ferried in from a different climate altogether. These four-legged beasts had binocular eyes, something which was possessed by Terrans alone, so that told me they were not the Yotul. The fact that the Technocracy chose to have these animals present at the embassy must hold some meaning, though. The actual sapients were toting menacing guns, which immediately caused Naltor to stiffen; several of the digitigrade bipeds scowled at us, folding their reddish ears back.
So much for sneaking past without them noticing us. Dustin didn’t seem to think they’d take a shot at us, but I don’t see how posturing like they might is “doing us a favor.” Maybe I should’ve gotten that brain scan, just in case I need to be brought back from the dead.
“I’m sorry if we offended you,” I managed, causing the Yotul’s glowers to deepen. “We’re moving on. We won’t stand in front of your territory. I hope you have a pleasant day, and that you can forgive whatever we’ve done to upset you.”
One Yotul’s eyes shifted slightly, making it clear she was looking at Dustin. “We’re not angry with you, Bissem. Humanity’s stunt will fail, however, and we have the perfect ammunition. I’m regretful you’ll be caught in the crossfire. You never should’ve been.”
“Perfect ammunition?” the human echoed, curious in spite of himself. “What do you mean?”
“Ah, so you haven’t seen what the Tseia are saying about you? I think you should familiarize yourself with it. The Bissems don’t want you there. Stop being a fucking Fed. Because either way, when the Sapient Coalition sees what the Nomads said, they’ll know Bissems are fractured and dangerous. The anti-carnivores will have a field day, as you humans say!”
Naltor trudged forward with reluctance, a hint of worry in his eyes. “What did those shifty fucking Tseia do now? I won’t let them ruin things.”
“The Tseia expressed that they want nothing to do with aliens. Their official position is that xenos can’t be trusted. With how you humans decided to swoop in, and play Ralchi, I’d say they’re right. This is a disunified species that isn’t ready, and doesn’t need your salvation. We’ll show the whole SC that you’re not respecting their wishes. We’ll play the tapes for—”
Nulia grimaced, placing a paw on my back. “Let’s get moving. Now. We need to talk, in private at the hotel, about whatever the Tseia have done.”
“Agreed,” Naltor grumbled.
Cutting the tour short, as the Yotul continued to shout at us and insist that we’d never be admitted to the Coalition, the landing party hurried us away from the Technocracy embassy. I cast a glance over my shoulder, wondering what Dustin had meant by the fact that the former uplifts intended this opposition as a boon. Why were they so opposed to us getting a fair hearing at the Sapient Coalition, and becoming a part of the galaxy: a dream that sounded wonderful to me? Didn’t these Yotul know it’d be difficult enough for us, because of those anti-carnivores? With my joyful mood at visiting Earth erased, I walked toward our lodgings with defeated steps.
There was so much about various aliens, and their past, that left me disappointed to my very core. I just hoped that Bissems hadn’t generated a reason for me to be domestically disillusioned as well, with our own reactionary squabbles and in-fighting.
A/N - Chapter 10! Tassi and Naltor are captured landing at the spaceport on camera, as our favorite scientist proclaims her goodwill; they also witness the first contact team undergoing memory transcripts, as a sort of mission report, and have that groundbreaking technology...with its implications...explained. Our Bissem narrator doesn't want one just yet, but as we know by reading this, she does eventually get a scan. What do you think of this technology's first appearance, at least that's not in the future? Which side of the ethical debate are you on?
The trip proceeds to Embassy Row, introducing the Key Species, but it derailed by Yotul hostility. What do you think of the Yotul's fierce opposition to the Bissem uplift, and their intentions? Will it affect Tassi's chances of making a good impression with the SC? What do you think inspired the Tseia to not welcome the alien visitors?
As always, thank you for reading and supporting! Chapter 11 will release on Sunday, and it's a must-read, discussion starter that really flips the script and changes the entire tone; I hope it'll really fuel some shock, excitement, and discussion with the implications that are about to come to light. For those of you that haven't meshed with the Krev openers, laying a foundation, I think this'll be the chapter that it just clicks, so please do give it a look!
Comments
Some Lvm
@DemonVee: well, that is a lot of points to address! I will try to be brief, as I tend to scatter on long replies, pleas don't take it as a sign I am not giving your arguments proper thought! 1. No, I wasn't using "your money or your life" as an example of real choice - the opposite! I was using it as an example of something that sounds like a choice, but is really and ultimatum, a threat. 2. After thinking long and hard about it, I found that it wasn't Haliska's reaction to the fish cutlet that was the worst part of this first contact. It was Dustin telling Tassi and Naltor humanity "does not have the bandwidth for more than one embassy". This shows the BIssem that humanity does not really care about them, their culture, or their political situation. And it shows both us the readers, and the SC, that humanity isn't ready for this contact. 3. I honestly think you are reading this story with rosy glasses on. Please don't take this as an insult, but the way I interpret what Dusting conveyed to the Bissem is this: "Unite your planet, or die from starvation". Not all those nice and optional invites you listed. And hence to coercion: the species is facing extinction, but help will only come if they change their politics. 4. The biggest problem with number 3 is that this was not told directly to all countries. If that were the case, it might have been a different situation, it might even pushed the Bissem toward unity, even if by making them perceive humanity as a common foe. But Dustin and his gang chose to play favorites. They contacted one country. They landed there, and they told that country's representatives to go and talk to all other governments on the planet. Ho do you think China would react if the US told them: "Hey, some aliens just landed, and will give us the tech to solve the climate crises, if we become best of buddies!" Better yet, how do you think Iran and Russia will react? 5. Your example about a rich country trying to help the poor, war torn one, how do you imagine that happening? Which side of the civil war do they approach? How do they expect that side to uphold the conditions placed upon them? Better yet - how does the benevolent country make sure the poor country does in fact uphold the condition and not use the financial aid for war? I have seen real life footage of militants in a conflict zone beating starving civilians away from humanitarian relief trucks and taking it all for themselves. If we can't get aid to people who need it in small regions of earth, how TF do you expect us to manage it for an entire alien planet? 6. The dilemma is not contact / don't contact. It is about when to contact. The Yotul don't want to leave the BIssems in the dark forever, just until they invent FTL, and are ready to stand as equals, the way humanity did. Yes, NoP humanity did get some tech after making friends, but they also made the first and biggest step themselves. The Bissem may have been using their spare radio telescope time to look for some signals that would be evidence of a far away civilization they would never realistically meet, or even have a conversation with. They were absolutely not ready for aliens landing in their backyard and whisking them off to a galactic coalition. 7. At the end of the day, the problem isn't humanity effecting Bessem culture or politics. It is *how* humanity will effect them. And I think that is what the Yotul are worried about. The Venlil had enough scientific knowledge to understand the implications of gene edit reversal. Also, they were under no pressure to undertake this reversal. The Bissem have no knowledge to properly judge lab meat technology, and when it is pressed in to wide use due to the urgency of environmental collapse, it is bound to spawn massive paranoia. Look what happened in reality with Covid vaccines. And we had vaccines for over two centuries! To conclude: I think the Bissem, more than any NoP race, are an analogy for real life, modern day humans and earth. And I think NoP humanity is about to find out just how badly they overestimated their understanding of Bissem society and their own capabilities in managing relations with such a society. And this may ultimately end up being worse for the Bissems than having to deal with the environmental crisis on their own. One last thing: Many here have written: "forget about saving Bissem culture, save their lives". Well, the only way to do that, is to resolve to Fed tactics - after all, that is exactly what the Federation tried to do: Erase any culture that was in opposition to their agenda. We know from this chapter that at least one nation on Ivrana refuses to cooperate. So, what will humanity do now? Keep their promise and leave the Bissems to die, or work with only some countries?
DemonVee
@Some Lvm Man, are you really going to present "Your money or your life" as an example of a "genuine" choice? I know you probably didn't do it intentionally but that's like the text book example of a bad faith argument regarding choice. Some variation of it worms itself into discussions constantly, whether about religion, politics, war, etc. (Though, often in the opposite way to justify something that could happen.) That ain't a choice man, that's a threat. And that's not what's going on in this scenario. If you want a closer example to what is going on here, imagine a wealthy nation offering financial aid to a poorer, war turn nation (Going through a civil war) who just suffered a famine or some natural disaster crisis. The wealthy nation (Who doesn't want to get involved with the civil war but doesn't want to just let people suffer.) could say: "We can help with the crisis, but only if none of the money we offer goes towards the conflict." Than another wealthy nation (One that had a history with another entity who used coercion against them for their own ends, skewing their perception of international relations) says: "Nooo, you fiend!" How dare you interfere with their internal politics by saying where their money goes." I don't know how you perceive both stances, but to me nation 1's stipulations seem reasonable. While nation 2's judgement is affected by their own historical trauma. Just as the UN's stipulation of: "We can help the planet, but only if we're helping THE PLANET and not just individual nations." While the Yotul are reacting with an extremist position of not risking even the slightest change to their culture/politics because of their own experience. (Falling into that "sample of one" problem that all Feds struggle with, even the Yotul seemingly.) (((Though, neither side is probably doing this out of pure altruism, while using this as a way to advance their ideology. But that's not exactly evil either. The Yotul want to stop any future uplifting, and are willing to sacrifice the Bissem by either political assassination or ecological disaster to make that happen. While Humanity likely wants to advance their goals or rooting out old Federation beliefs, practices and predator biases, and are willing to put the Bissem on the Galactic spot light to make that happen.))) As I said before, every group that interacts with each other will experience a change in politics, philosophy and culture. The question whether it's right or wrong depends if there was coercion involved. Humanity hasn't been uplifted (Kinda, they got a ton of advanced tech from the Venlil and went from single system people into an interstellar super power), yet even if you just stick to their diplomatic interactions and exclude the war. Their contact made changes on Human culture and politics. Tarva's stance was essentially: "We're not going to get involved with your own internal politics, but the Venlil aren't going to deal with 200 individual squabbling governments, figure this out amongst yourselves." Which contributed towards the centralization of Earth's government. Are the Venlil in the wrong for indirectly affecting Earth's politics and culture? If not, how is it different than Humanity's position in this situation? Further more, has Humanity done a cultural ill upon the Yotul because their culture transferred over to Yotul youths who started dying their fur? Or was it wrong for Humanity to push their own cultural views upon their allies? After all, stuff like predator disease, exterminators, how they treat their mentally ill, how they treat animals or the environment all relates to their culture and politics, and some made the argument that Humanity had no right to get involved with their internal affairs as long as they don't get involved with theirs. Humanity was advocating for changes to their culture, politics and even genetic code. How is it different than the Federation? Again, the key factor is choice. The Federation beat cultures into submission and manipulated them to fit their own needs. While Humanity offered arguments for for their positions and criteria to join the SC and species voluntarily agreed. You can't really compare Federation "uplifting" to what is being attempted here, because what the Federation did was basically just a veiled Annexation of a planet, where they installed a puppet government and started brutally repressing people. The Zurulians were engineered into being the Galaxy's clinic and the Gojids were turning into their soldiers. The Duerten were Eugenicsed into being the opposite of what they once were and the Venlil were turned meek due to having undesirable demeanours. The Yotul's uplifting was basically just an invasion where they took control with a puppet government and started forcefully replacing their culture. Remember the Arxur? Even Tarva knew that the Federation made contact with the intent of specifically changing their "aggressive culture", and that was before they even knew that they were basically coerced into using bioweapons on themselves, and all the other culture manipulation done on others. How is any of that that comparable to: "Hey, we wanted to let you know that you're not alone. Here is the state of the Galaxy, why and where you stand in it. We would like to help you with your environment and help you establish diplomatic relations with your galactic neighbours, if that's what you wish?" What the Bissem do from there isn't binary, and like Todd mentioned they don't have to go to war immediately, they have every reason to try diplomacy first. If anything, Humanity could offer help mediating between the groups and state that if they resort to war over this the deal is null. (Btw, I noticed you two mentioned ICBMs. The battles in NoP seemed to involved firing thousands of missiles at each other which I think were nuclear tipped, only for most of them to just get swatted out of the void by defences. And Humanity was specifically mentioned developing anti bombardment tech.) Sure, Humanity (technically) has no experience with uplifting, but the Yotul's experience, along with every other Federation member experience was tainted by the crimes conducted by the shadow cast. (If you ask someone who got mugged in Rome for travel advice, they aren't very likely to sing Italy's praises afterwards after all.) The best help they would be in this instance is if they watched over the uplifting and made sure that nothing that happened to them was repeated here. But instead they are willing to throw the Bissem to the wolves to support their ideology. If Humanity has no experience in contacting new civilizations, they aren't going to gain it by not contacting them. Eventually the SC will have to learn how to contact another civilization properly, and maybe it's best for the one species who didn't get colonized to do it first. And if the ramifications of contacting an alien civilization are really that severe, than they should have just stayed on Earth because if life is other there, someone is bound to bump into someone eventually. -------------- What do the readers know about the Bissem? Not much, the story just started and fans can only make speculations based on what SP mentioned so far. What Humanity knows? They have been observing them for (2 years I think, more?) Which should be enough to get a sense of their culture, political situation and potential reactions to their interaction. Is it enough? Never will be, at some point you godda bite the bullet and make the contact, though the more you delay the more paranoid the native faction will be about you observing them for that long, fearing a vast gap in what they know of you and what you know of them. So a balance has to be struck. (One that wasn't necessarily here due to the urgent nature of the situation.)
Willie
The yotul do have a few good points about anti-predators and from they're experience uplift was deeply traumatic The bissem are in the middle of major societal growing pains and may not be ready but ecologically they really can't wait for them to develop any further realistically I do hope we get more pov's from the biss specifically from different zones something interesting is off page I'm sure.
Some Lvm
@ToddTheSquid: what makes you think humanity has any capability of stopping swarms of ICBMs? NoP is not the old Battlestar Galactica. Maybe if they station a decent size fleet of ships and drones in Irvana's orbit they would be able to do it, but even than they won't be able to do much about ground forces, short of fully entering the war. And I don't think a military fleet in orbit will inspire a lot of confidence on the side of the Bessems... Of course Bissem will try to talk first. But there is a good chance these talks would fail, and each side becomes more dogmatic in their approach. As I understand it, though there is peace between the Bissems now, it is a tense peace, especially with some nations driving an isolationist policy. I certainly hope this is not where the story is heading, but it is a very realistic possibility in my view.
ToddTheSquid
Humanity also has the ability to step in and stop such a war before it starts, or even just say "No. Work together, talk it out, or we won't help you at all. Diplomacy first." Plus, do you really think the bissem would immediately turn to war without trying diplomacy first? I don't. They're clearly more civilized than that.
Some Lvm
@DemonVee "your money or your life" is also a choice. But more directly, you make good points, but I feel you are missing a critical issue here: There is a very tricky part in "make a decision as a planet" when it comes to the Bissem. I don't know if your read the google doc describing their history, but basically right now the Bissem don't even have the equivalent to the UN, where as on earth, when they first ventured in to the galaxy, the UN was much more powerful and meaningful than it is now in reality. Humanity had a body that could make planet wide decisions and get countries to comply without going to war. The Bissem don't have that! Humans basically landed in a country that is similar to the 80's US, and told them: "Your planet is about to die. We can help you, but only if all the nations on your planet agree to work with us." And now we find out at least one of the Bissem nations is refusing. So, what will the Bissem do? Say "we tried" and go off to extinction, or turn on the one section of their global society they believe is dragging all of them to hell? Basically, while not wanting to mess with Bessem politics, humanity gave them an ultimatum that is all but guaranteed to start a world war. I think the Bissem have nukes at this point, so they may end up extinct before their fish. And this is why I still support the Yotul position, even after reading many pro-human posts here that temporarily put me on the fence: Helping the Bissem survive an ecological disaster is the moral thing to do, but so far, it does not look like humanity is in the position to do so! Just because they have the technology that can solve the most immediate problem, does not mean they can just hand it over and watch Bissem live happily ever after. Remember what happened with the Arxur? The Federation didn't just try to cure them. They gave the worst elements of their society the technology and the idea on how to win, and turn the entire Arxur race in to a bunch of cannibals. Humanity may not have the same intentions as the Feds, but they also have 0 experience contacting pre-FTL civilizations and uplifting them. Unlike the Yotul - humanity was neither uplifted nor contacted. And the NoP humanity did face many disasters, both man made and natural on their own, and pulled through. So - do we the readers, and more importantly - does NoP humanity, know enough about the Bissems to start messing with their politics and environment?
Adam Myers
I am going to say it, I want a friendly Yulpa in the story now.
Adam Myers
Not only is there a fractured Arm, but the species of the federation weren't as numerous as humanity. But, it does sound small...
Adam Myers
@Elliot, I disagree. I think that the SC is trying to choose a lesser evil, the Yotul are more about ideological purity in opposing uplifting (and paranoia about fed remnants). The Yotul are probably on the warpath to root out any fed sympathies in the SC, probably to ridiculous rights-violating ways.
Adam Myers
@Bas Donders look up Earworms on the subreddit. Onso is in it, and SP has decreed it canon.
BoxBoy
Pretty interesting developments so far, can't wait for the next chapter. Real interested to see what the Yotul end up doing
Davis R
I'm Commander Dustin, and this is my favorite store on Embassy Row. Big mass effect vibes going on! So far really liking the spirit of non-herbivores or even just another alien species completley removed from old federation programing. Keep it up!
Kilo Rat
I keep holding my breath until we find out what happened to our boy Slanek!
TheBlack2007
If Dustin is honest about the SC's reasoning, they didn't have much of a choice though. The Yotul were subjugated during their equivalent of the early to mid-Industrial Age. They already had Steam Technology and were in the midst of transitioning from a traditional agricultural to an industrialized society. The Bissem are an Information-age society whose impact on their planet has reached a critical tipping point with them still being far away from developing self-sustaining or at least low-ecological footprint technology. Without intervention, this would lead to the collapse of their society and maybe their entire ecosystem with Billions dying. The Yotul are right to be distrustful after what happened to them - but I think they are still wrong morally for the reasons I stated above.
DemonVee
I can't see how being offered a genuine choice can be considered in any way as an indirect use of coersion or force. And any culture that meets another will start experiencing a political, sociological and philosophical shift, and it doesn’t matter if its a culture that gets contact by another or if they venture out themselves, or even what stage they are in their development. The only way to prevent that is depriving them of that choice and artificially enforcing isolationism upon them, like their system was some sort of sapient animal reserve.
ToddTheSquid
That's the point, that would've happened regardless of when and why they were contacted. Wait till after they discover FTL? Culture shift. 40 years ago if the humans were there at the time? Culture shift. Just cause? Culture shift. Fed style? Culture shift. Culture isn't static. Cultures meld and blend together naturally over time and shift in response to each other. There is no such thing as preserving culture. You can try to have a minimal effect on it, but ultimately there will be an effect. Remember that "cultural purity" is a core belief of some of the worst, most isolationist and authoritarian ideologies the world has ever seen irl.
ToddTheSquid
Apology accepted. I'm also sorry for being aggressive in return.
Rick VanHoute
sucks the Yotul are being an issue but I understand the reasoning.
Sobek
I think the Yotul kind of have a point, and Naltor sorta proves them right and might end up being a friend to them. The fact is that while not forcing anything on the Bissem the SC has made a big move and the fact they are interfering may cause massive fractures on the place. Think if Aliens shower up in 1982 while the cold war was heating up very fast, things might quickly lead towards a spiral. That said, one can't say that NoP2 doesn't offer one hell of a plot.
Sobek
You make good points but the fact is that the Bissem ARE being forced. The Sapient Coalition may not be directly forcing them but the implications are simply too big and the mere contact has caused a massive shift on the political, sociological and philosophical makeup of the Bissem.
Yannis Morris
Carnivores on the verge of a food crisis. The Bissems being a Second Arxur gains more credence
Yannis Morris
All good points and I feel bad that all I can say is that Zhao made that exact point about non-interference meaning you think you’re better than them.
mitsos_pr
Tbh I think that the Yotul are going to be the decoy antagonists, like the Arxur were in the beginning of NOP1. Humans have been so kind to them that I cannot imagine the Yotul attacking humanity. Probably it will be more like a cold war, because humans also will not accept being at the mercy of the Yotul. And anyway the Yotul seem to be more concerned about the anti-carnivores than the humans. As for the population issue, I agree that the Yotul will have had some exponential population growth. But humanity grew a lot as well, colonizing many planets. And they have a much larger starting population, which is important. Finally, it might not be so bad for the galaxy to have a non - evil power counterbalancing humanity. I was fearing a Humanity First coup in the beginning of NOP2.
Elliott
Actually it's more likely the Yotul would have a greater growing population at this time due to the leap in technology. I've said it before and I'll say it again, Yotul are the space Chinese. They already proved themselves very capable during the war and seemed determined to never be in a position of weakness again. Thucydides Trap dictates war with the Yotul (and possibly the Arxur as their allies) is almost inevitable, especially with the likely catastrophe that the SC in Irvana is going to cause.
Elliott
I'm seeing a lot of similarities to the Yotul and China the more I think about it, this is an abused people who finally got a chance at independence from oppression and foreign influence who have learned the lessons the greater community seems to be unwilling to learn. This is one of the reasons I believe they're so close with the Arxur as they share that in failed uplift trauma and foreign manipulation too. The pathway to evil is paved by good intentions, and the SC is possibly doing more harm than good.
Elliott
I saw this all coming from the first NoP, and I suspect that the Arxur and Yotul are going to grow closer as a result after seeing whatever catastrophe is about to occur due to humanity-led SC meddling with the Bissem. Remember these are two species who have first-hand experience with failed/botched uplifting so they're bound to take offense to this anyway.
Elliott
You're putting a lot of faith in humanity just because we were acting kind 30 years ago. The Yotul were also uplifted by a galactic government telling them about an invisible future threat (the Arxur). Both threats posed/pose danger of extinction, so really nothing has changed in their eyes. As is being inferred now, an entire faction on Irvana doesn't want aliens there, and might become violent/xenophobic. This whole thing could spiral out of control even with the SC doing everything right on their end. Seems ridiculous, but what happens if Bissems go down the route of the Arxur, or just go full "Imperium of Bissem Man", what if a Yhatzee faction, like Betterment did, uses aliens as an excuse to unite and destroy us as they're being uplifted? So many variables go into this and the Yotul and Arxur know it from experience.
Elliott
More complicated than that by a mile. Remember that the Yotul were uplifted by the Federation claiming the exact same thing: "We need to help you or else you're all gonna die from this invisible future threat!" Both threats were/are very real but the Yotul are thinking humanity will jump the gun and do what the Feds did. Thing is I kind of agree with them, atleast a bit. Making contact shouldn't been a problem, but pressuring them and trying to forcefully induct them into our galactic government, pick sides, stir conflict, and tamper in their world's culture and tech?
Elliott
The Yotul are actually acting exactly as one would in their shoes. They once were uplifts who were meddled with and influenced by alien colonizers. Now humanity is essentially doing the same thing, though arguably for much better reasons.
Elliott
I saw the Yotul becoming a potential threat for the SC all the way back in the war arc. They're much like China or any other rising power that's been mistreated in the past. I can definitely see them having closer ties with the Arxur than humanity or any other species. On another note, the comment the guard made poses the question of why don't the Bissem consider a Irvanan United Nations? I assume tensions are high on their planet, but even in our Cold War nations would be willing to play diplomatic ball on an international level. Though culture and politics there could be radically different. Can't wait to see how this all pans out.
DemonVee
The arguments against uplifting are just as smug, though due to seeing a culture "too primative" to be trusted being on the same level as you rather than out of seeing yourself as some type of savior. And cultural intrusion/contamination will be a factor when ever any two foreign groups meet. The only antidote is complete isolationism. The factor whether uplifting is ethical or not is choice, but they have to be aware that there is a choice they could be making. Imagine a species that you could have contacted, but decided not to disturbed their own cultural development finally reach the stars after 700 years, after going through two global catastrophes and four dark ages. They learn that you've been watching all this time and say... "You were there, you saw our each and every hard ship as billions died in famnines, or while crying out for miricle medicine that you could have shared. You never asked if we wanted would have wanted contact or if we would have asked your guidance to find unity and peace... Why?!" But of course, in the end their culture didn't remain pure. Because regardless of when they made contact, interacting with another culture will have an influence on yours and theirs, and the callousness of having all their dreams dangled infront of them for centuries was enough shift their culture towards being more apathetic.
DemonVee
If a civil war is likely, I imagine proximity will play a part on the sides. The Venli, Gojids and Zurulians wouldn't be first in like to go to war with Earth being that close to their borders.
DemonVee
A question is that if their propaganda stunt backfires and starts a wild fire that can't be containrd whether they will realize their own fault and own up or double down and find a way to blame Humanity due to their "savior of the primatives" complex that's developing right before our eyes? And I agree, their stance is saddenning. It's not like their concerns with uplifting are 100% invalid, there are real issues with getting involved with an alien culture which the yotul could make sure don't interfere with the Bisse if they took an active part in thw uplifting. But instead they are going into the most extreme positions. (Also the fact that they started using espionage for blackmail, seemingly against allies... )
DemonVee
The yotul here remind me of that one star trek episode where the Federation just let a species die in a planetary cataclysm because of the first directive. "Preserving culture and their natural development" Honestly, at that point if it means callously sanding by and watching millions, billions die... Fuck their cultural purity, there is no culture after they're dead and when ever two groups meet there will always be some intermixing, certain traditions will die while new ones will be born. Further more, doing what the Yotul and the star trek Federation do will just corrupt your own culture into a people that just looks down and snears at those you deem bellow you out of some percieved sense of doing them a favour (A bit of dark irony with the Yotul I suppose) while not even giving them a chance. It's not like the Bissem are being forced to comply, they were made aware of where they sit in galactic politics, their ecological fears were confirmed, they've been encouraged to make some diplomatic visits to asses their options for themselves and they've been offered help that they are free to reject, with a single condition that they accept it as a planet so that the SC doesn't have to get involved with their internal politics. Yet the Yotul are acting like Humanity touched down on their planet and immediately started burning history museums and indoctrinating children. "Humanity is forcing the Bissem into a carnivore hating galaxy" They were already in that galaxy and made themselves known to the orion arm with their own broadcasts. Being bound to thier world wouldn't spare them from any faction willing to do harm, but gaining contact with other species gives a chance for allies if such a threat would come. (Hell, remember that Earth was almost exterminated without Humanity ever knowing about life beyond their world) "The Bissem are too fractured, they are not ready" Who are the Yotul to make that judgement on their behalf, they can prove that on their own, deciding whether unity is worth a shot in these events or hell, just reject contact with the galaxy if they don't even want to deal with the stars. But they are worth the opertunity to make that decision on their own. Plus, why apply Federation standards of planetary unity that were never forced upon that species? For all we know the true galactic standard is having multiple planetary nations even well into their interstellar age. Hell, for the species that we know invented FTL on their own. Earth started sending out star ships before they even united, and only really did so out of desperation fighting the war. The farsul are made up of tribes, and Vieq mentioned that 1970s earth appeared to be more orginized then they are. And the Kolshians having a commonwealth to me implies that they either are or were made up of nation like entities that joined into a union of some kind. Expecting species to conjoin into a world government before contact could be an unreasonable stance from any faction.
Lokyar
There are a lot of ways to abuse the transcript technology, and it's not always going to be true that the transcript you're reading isn't heavily edited by some meddling historian or politician. However, it's non-invasive, and not really much different than Dustin or Tassi writing and releasing their memoirs. Ultimately with the tech already out there, it's going to be abused by SOMEONE, so why not get what benefits you can out of it? As for the Yotul, they've been opposed to uplifting from the birth of the SC, so I'm not surprised they're against it now; and let's face it: they have damn good reason to be. The Tseia is another failure of Dustins. Its clear he didn't wait for a diplomatic response or offer to take Bissem from other nations, or he'd have known that they were already taking a xenophobic stance. By not waiting for representatives from all Bissem nations, he shows clear favouritism to the one he landed at. This will cause resentment and opposition which could easily have been avoided, and gives the Yotul the ammo they wanted... and with the continuing fractures between nations on earth, humanity should have been ready for this. There's not really any excuse. Sure, they might have been opposed ANYWAY, but by not giving them the chance to respond and showing clear favouritism to a rival or enemy state, Dustin nigh guaranteed it.
DemonVee
The Federation thought they had good reasons, no one does things because they think they are the bad guys.
paintmelikeyoudoyoursheilas
Ultimately the point is sort of moot. The reason the operation went ahead is because the bissem world is facing imminent extinction and Ultimately the yotul agreed that in such a case first contact is called for as they are not going to just watch a species go extinct. It seems they either have gotten cold feet or forgotten what they'd agreed to, letting the hate for the federation cloud sound judgement
paintmelikeyoudoyoursheilas
Also as far as I've read there hasn't been anything yet explicitly showing humanity's naval strength. I'd imagine it'd be very significant to prevent earth ever being even considered a viable military target again
EliasArt2Life
I’m 99% sure the Mazics will be against the Bissem joining. Historically, they’ve been very stuck to their beliefs. They only joined us because they thought that the Federation was a sinking ship, but didn’t really expect us to be better than the Arxur. They only started to trust us after we proved ourselves by saving their home world. Even then, they were adamant until the end that the Arxur were evil and had no redeeming qualities. I suspect that they will be against the Bissem, but won’t hold it against humanity, feeling that it is in our nature, rather than malicious intent.
EliasArt2Life
To be fair, that’s why humanity is ONLY NOW making contact. The Bissem are reaching the point of no return, and it’ll likely nearly destroy, if not entirely destroy, their civilization and planet in the process. I believe that the logic is that “anything bad that could happen can’t be worse than leaving them to die out”. Of course, that sounds eerily like the Federation’s reasoning to uplift the Arxur. Except that isn’t entirely accurate to, since we now know that they were thinking “we need to change this species to be more like what we want them to be”. That being said, I do believe that there’s a fine line. On the other hand, there’s a fine line between non-interference, and leaving a species to die, like what the Farsul and Kolshians did to the Thafki. Cultural tampering, even if it’s just indirect or unintentional, is basically impossible at this point, but is that really worse than leaving them to die in an ecological based food shortage? I’ll point out that even Star Trek (which is one of the most strict at adhering to non-interference, despite many viewers disagreeing) had captains make exceptions to their non-interference rule, The Prime Directive, and that saving a species/people on the brink of collapse/extinction was one of those. On the other hand, those episodes also pointed out just how bad even that interference was. It really is quite a philosophical, and ethical, conundrum.
Some Lvm
@Bas Donders check out the cover art for the physical book: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CQ5QNWBV Great picture of a Venlil!
Space Paladin
No, just a treat since I want this chapter out pretty bad lol
PhycoKrusk
I'm really not. But I'm going to drop the subject there, I'm going to apologize for being so aggressive, and I'm not going to offer any excuse beyond that this has been the worst day in a bad year and I shouldn't have tried to make that your fault.
DemonVee
I always found the entire "what, you are broken up between nations, you're so fractured" thing kinda weird considering the farsul were broken up between tribes and one of them literally said that she thinks their planet is more united than theirs.
Byron Ritchie
@blake that’s fair as well
Byron Ritchie
@willy fair I agree
Jay Scott Raymond
@Some Lvm Re: " just because Dustin said the collapse was imminent, does not mean he was right, or working with reliable data" I'm sorry but that's a heckuva stretch. Dustin made a point of saying that the problem was examined, modeled and simulated to a fare-thee-well. That's not to say they can't possibly be wrong, but given the tech of the setting, its a vanishingly small possibility.
ToddTheSquid
I know exactly what you think. You think you know better than people who've spent their entire lives studying the issue. I don't need to know more than that. You are proving my point for me, you Luddite.
Some Lvm
@Alex: politics and politicians do not exist to solve problems. They don't really exist to create them either, but too often that is conducive to them remaining in power, so it happens quite often. That said, there is nothing wrong with violence per se, or with flaunting it. Its all about how you use it and for what.
It depends on the beliefs of the original person. Plenty of people would be fine with having a clone of themselves take over their lives if they were to die, which therefore means that the clone with their memories would know that and probably integrate smoothly into their life. Others believe that a clone with their memories made after they die just straight up would be them. Conveniently there is a memory transcript of their brain to figure out if they would be able to handle that sort of thing or if they would respond poorly to it
Lunam
This gives off a mix of trauma and betrayal. From their perspective: The Yotul were absolutely fucked up by the Federation and then became one of Humanity's most powerful allies.... only for the Humans to turn around and commit the same meddling as the Federation. They think they are witnessing history repeat itself. It is completely understandable, which is what makes it all the more tragic.
George Smith
I’m not so sure they did do some joint operations with the arxur and that was basically the evil Empire.
George Smith
They also quite frankly are playing politics. They picked one group to contact, which is giving them their seal of approval so to speak. They picked the group that was most like them, and just went with that instead of talking with everyone.
Ryan Cox
What have they bullied them in to, exactly?
EliasArt2Life
I understand the Yotul position, but it feels very much like they’re forgetting that the Bissem are on the brink of a food shortage. Or… rather…. I think that they MISUNDERSTAND the food shortage. They once fought wars over food shortages (their “Grain Wars”), and they survived, so I’m willing to bet that they think the Bissem will too. However, the Bissem survive on fish. A meat food shortage is TOTALLY different from a plant food shortage. The fish live in a rapidly decaying environment, and need years of life to reproduce. This is more similar to trying to grow an orchard on soil that has been stripped of its nutrients. By the sound of it, the Bissem only recently started to invest into mass farming; they don’t have the infrastructure to survive on that, and riots will likely destroy the farms before they can sustain ANY population. I’ve felt from the start that the Yotul should have had a major part of the first contact project; if they are worried about a Federation repeat, they should do it themselves. Instead, they are taking the stance that the likely near or complete extinction of the Bissem is better than the possible failed upliftment. Furthermore, the suggested “ammunition” they’re planning on using is terrible. It may work, but if it does, it’ll worsen the galaxy’s opinion of carnivores, pre-FTL civilizations, fractured societies, and more. That’ll affect the Yotul, and likely many other species they come across. I don’t think that the Yotul are prepared for the consequences of these actions. Propaganda is all fine… until you need to cooperate with the people you demonized, and realize that no one is letting go of the hook, line, and sinker they fell for. It would be really funny (although tragic, and I don’t think it’s likely) if instead of having the desired effect, the Yotul’s propaganda convinces the rest of the SC that the Bissem NEED their help to stop this division, essentially going into a more Federation-like stance, and the Yotul (and humans) have to deal with the repercussions. It would definitely show another angle of “it’s not really about if you’re ready for us, it’s about if we’re ready for you.”
Roscuro
I have an inkling to the Yotuls perspective, and understand it, but think their trauma is clouding their judgement.
Alex
Welcome to how to make one of the most eye-opening conflicts 101: Neither side has ill intent just a disagreement on what are the causes what are the effects and what’s unrelated to the outcome. This course is also known as how to write a story to tell any political party to shut their mouth and listen to the other side so they can figure out the actual causes and effects. For most of the political disagreements in the US, if both sides got together, and actively tried to get to the root cause of the thing they’re trying to solve and arguing over the solution about, could probably find that they’re both right and wrong in some respects, and that some things are self fulfilling prophecies in a causal loop. With some of those loops having a portion the circle in not necessarily good subculture, like the ones that encourage crime, with role models who flaunt violence, and behavior that leaves many without fathers if law and order are enforced.
Yannis Morris
It’s a great historical tool but it is the very definition of a biased source. It really can’t be the only historical record
Piittis
I'm gonna be blunt, that is a really stupid way to look at things. Yes, the elite don't care about the ecological collapse or what happens to the world, but that doesn't mean it isn't a real thing. They're not the ones who study ecology, they're not the ones who figure out possible threats to the ecosystem; scientists are the ones who do that. You mostly just hear the famous people talk about it because that's how social media works. Those people are famous, so anything they say is pushed to the front. And the reason those people talk about those things is because it makes them look better, plain and simple; just like how big companies will act all supportive during Pride month while not actually doing anything to support LGBTQ people. Going by your logic, school shootings aren't a real problem in the US, because if they were then politicians would've done something about them.
TheBlack2007
Military through and through: "WTF?! This shit is highly unethical! Can't wait to use it on my enemies!"
Some Lvm
@Jay Scott: you make a good point but so does Phyco: The thing is, just because Dustin said the collapse was imminent, does not mean he was right, or working with reliable data. Also, he has no way of knowing if the Bissems could have survived the collapse. Essentially, I think at this point it is a gamble: Take the Yotul approach and risk a mass extinction of the first new species discovered since the creation of the SC, or take the human approach and risk completely destroying the Bissems' future and everything that makes their civilization unique. One thing bothers me: a proper first contact would have been to either send representatives to every nation on the planet, even if there is risk of harm to the ambassadors, or make a global contact over comms. Favoring a single nation in the way our party did is definitely a recipe for disaster.
Bas Donders
Totally unrelated to your argument, why do people think the Yotul are kangaroo-based? I know they're often described as marsupials, but wombats, opossums, and quokka are marsupials as well. Same question for the venlil as well, actually. Sometimes I think of them as nekomimi, sometimes I think of them as rabbit people. I only read the posts, I've never gone through any of the reddit discussions. Maybe it was made clearer there.
Sworishina
I had headcanoned that the Yotul would be deeply involved in uplifting and its regulation, but this works too
Some Lvm
I did not expect the transcript tech to be introduced this soon, and it is a bit odd they had that whole conversation right in front of the cameras, on the landing pad... As for the tech, there is no question in my mind that there is way more potential for its abuse, than there is for benefits. Contrary to the team's claims - its a crappy historical tool, and actual audio visual recording devices would have been much better. The reason its no good for historical records, is because it would be completely tainted by perception. Sure - its fun for us the readers to experience the story in this format, and it would give historians a psychological insight, but it would never produce an accurate, unbiased account of any events. Yes, footage and recordings could also be manipulated, especially in the age of AI, but at least there an effort could be made to simply record what is. With a memory transcription, it is always "what subject X though it was". Also, an interesting point: the scans are completely voluntary, until they are not. So just think what hell will break loose once the tech becomes wireless. Anyone here watched "Dollhouse"? https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1135300/ And frankly - if I were a first contact team supervisor or had to untangle a mess they caused, I would take a bodycam footage over a brain scan any day. Of course, technology is a type of jenie that you just can't put back in the bottle. Once someone figures out it can be done, it will be done. You might as well make a legal and social framework to deal with it, rather than trying to suppress it. And privacy? The current generation gave that up completely over a decade ago, I am surprised people in 2160 even know the word.
Tyler Ellis
Wait wait wait, I want to add something to my civil war theory (that I stated earlier here) just to see if I’m correct later. Either way the Yotul being against us, I got a feeling that the races who’ve been historically pro-ish human are going to be the opposing side here, Zurilians, Mazics, etc. and races who’ve been our “mortal enemies” are going to be on the pro human side, the Kolashans, Farsul, and Yulpa bc we gave them a second chance and also bc we more than likely propped up their government with pro human figures. Maybe we’ll see other old enemies on our side, like the Krokatol and the Tillfish (since they realize they were omnivore too). I just wanted to spit this out there.
Dookus Maximus
I like how the Bissem are more or less a reflection of us in our current day and age, and it will be interesting to explore how we might possibly react to benevolent aliens suddenly showing up on our doorstep. In NoP1, an existential threat with guns and bombs did wonders to unite humanity, but it's different when the existential threat is environmental. I mean, we're seeing climate change happening in real time and people still argue it isn't real. Looking forward to to seeing how things play out!
Blake S
Their are very many angles you can critique uplifting from, and i love how to yotuls stance is essentially "f##k you no". I can imagine it must be maddening as even with the fed inteference thier must be load of species who still think uplifting is a great thing.
Danny Luca
I’m so happy to see Nulia call Marcel her adoptive dad instead of chaperone! But finding out he’s off-grid???? WHAT IS HAPPENING?!?! Every chapter with Nulia is an emotional rollercoaster stemming from just a couple lines from her. Marcel better have an explanation
Blake S
Yotuls play is interesting, It was a given how against the bissem upliff they are. It seems like their trying to throw every spanner in the works they can including smearing the species their trying to help? I suppose this might just be them trying to throw a spanner in the works at every step. Its a very yotul way of going about things, as opposed to lobying for greater protections and rights for the uplifted species. But id imagine its hard to be purly logical about this topic for the yotul, especially since a large portion of the population is coming down from fed pd treatment meds. Allso The idea of Uplifting is inherently intrusive and smug. The decision to uplift regardless of your idealism, is the decision to uproot the lives of billions, an entire civilization. Whatever they were dealing with before is now mute, you have made the decision to be the biggest deal in all their lives. And you have put yourself in a position to alter the course of thier society forver as a complete outsider. The species has no say in this upheavel and even if they did how could they say no. Do you simply turn down technology, idea, medicine thaf could save lives and make things better for everyone. Do you want to be the guy to turn down an easy free cancer treatment or life extension, or a soloution to the energy crisis because your worried about a little cultural contamination.
Jay Scott Raymond
The ozone hole is not gone. Its still there, on track to finally close up sometime in the 2050s. Still, it is essentially a solved problem as long as we don't start using CFCs again. You keep ignoring that Dustin said that the ecological collapse of the oceans is imminent. The Bissems don't have time to "figure it out" before mass starvation occurs. This fact is the driver behind the human's urgency to make this first contact. That one fact easily override's all the other concerns you've mentioned. I really hope it turns our that the Yotul didn't know that fact because otherwise it means they've gone full retard, and you should never go full retard.
Blake S
Chad yotul sticking to thier ideals, they violently dont wanf their cultural losses to be done onto another race.
Paperclip
The widespread use of the word has kinda changed the definition to be more like "facts". But still, your definition of based can still fit in my comment if the Yotul giving up their based status means them agreeing to help the Bissems
Blake S
Well they arguably have good reasons, alot the galaxy likely isnt quite ready for the bissem and it sounds like some of the bissem arent either. That being said neither was humanity really.
Jay Scott Raymond
You are again ignoring the text of the story. Tassi not being an eco-scientist is irrelevant. Dustin mentioned that other Bissem scientists are aware of the problem. Also, once again Dustin mentioned that the problem is too imminent to wait and that's the driver for this first contact.
Dookus Maximus
I hope we get some more nuanced opinions from the Yotul diplomats, and not Joe Schmo Gung Ho embassy guard
Dookus Maximus
I mean, based kinda means doing your own thing no matter what others think. So this is about as based as the Yotul could be
Vladi Vladi
I don't recommend trying to resurrect people using brain scans, Necrosofts have the tendency to be their own people, with massive impostor syndrome and unstable mindsets
Vladi Vladi
20 billion is a pretty low number. Is that everyone in the Solar System? It can't be everyone in the Sapient Coalition, there were over 40 species DURING the war and many more now. There's more than just SC embassies on Earth too, how weird.
Anemoia
Well there's also the fact that they're carnivores in a galaxy that hasn't exactly been welcoming to them. Sure the Kolshians and Farsul are subdued, but the neutral species and the Shield are still out there, outside the SC's control. And while it may be an unnecessary precaution, humanity is still operating under the belief that "predatory features" are a target among other so-far uncontacted aliens. Evidenced by Dustin's hesitance to reveal his face to the Bissems and the Ark colonists' secretive relationship with the Krev.
TheDudeAbides
Yeah I think Adam has the right idea. The Bissem are far more violently divided than earth was when we met the Venlil and even them Earth was the weird planet because we still had nations. The Bissem still have nations and they're seemingly on the brink of a war if one of them looks at the other the wrong way.
TheDudeAbides
Just because people are still being selfish and ignoring the catastrophe that is our climate in favor of their personal comfort doesn't mean it ain't happening my man.
Gumcel
One time thing.
Tyler Ellis
Hmm I figured the SC wasn’t all rainbows and sunshine but now it seems royally fucked. There’s the Yotul yeah but they mentioned in an earlier chapter the Krakotol are fractured. Civil war is brewing and humanity sees something in the Bissems and thinks they may be “the key”, at least that’s my theory. Meaning only earth probably supported contact with them.
PhycoKrusk
I understand that the elites who are saying that ecological collapse is around the corner continue to fly on private jets, continue to buy yachts, and continue to build and live in homes that require so much climate control that they blast out more carbon dioxide in a day than I do on an entire month, but somehow, you and I are the problem. _We_ have to completely change the way that we live. _They_ get to continue living exactly the way they have been. We have to stop traveling, they don't. We have to give up air conditioning, they don't. We have to eating strawberries all year round, they don't. We have to sacrifice, they don't. So no, I don't think ecological collapse is around the corner, because those anointed few that claim it is conduct themselves like the skies will be blue forever, and if they don't have to sacrifice a single thing to save the planet, then I don't see why I should have to either. Don't you _ever_ presume to understand what I think unless I've told you.
th3h4ck3r
Also, what's with the Sunday release? New release schedule?
th3h4ck3r
You do realize that the problem with Earth's ocean is currently getting worse, right? We didn't stop talking about it, it just stopped being news. Fish stocks are still plummetting, coral reefs are still dying en masse, etc. The *only* aspect in which we've improved is the ozone layer, and only because that regenerates after a few years of not using CFCs.
th3h4ck3r
Keep in mind that the Feds used "humans are always fighting with each other" as a reason as to why they wouldn't let us live, among other things. Also, the Bissems (at least this faction) were a species actively looking for extraplanetary life. This is literally what they wanted.
Brianreal
Damn, the Yotul became the very thing they hated. Kinda ironic to go from the most sensible species in the federation to total assholes to new uplifts. Just like the feds.
Wingit98
Yeah, that ending with the Yotul in the first part definitely made me feel like we may be butting heads with them later But also, man.... Our first contact crew should be trying to weave at least some purely good things to tell the bissems. They seem overwhelmed enough as it is.
ToddTheSquid
Oh, you're one of the people who doesn't think there's an ecological collapse around the corner. There's no point even trying to explain it to you then, you'll never understand.
ToddTheSquid
Earth is facing an eco collapse right now irl and we can't even all agree that it's happening, let alone what to do about it. The bissem are at a similar point in their history as we are today. Do you think that just because they're aliens means they'll automatically do better than we are now? That they'll ALL agree that something is wrong and also agree on the best way to fix it? Do you think they'll be able to do it in time?
ToddTheSquid
There's a difference between "not smart enough" and "don't have the tech and industrial base yet". Sure, they'll eventually figure it out. How long will that take? Years? Decades? Centuries? How many of the space penguins will die before they do? Billions? Will their society and diverse cultures survive this? Will the higher ups prioritize greed and selfishness and let the common people starve to death? Will it still be stoppable if that happens? Is it worth all those innocent lives just because some people aren't sure about the immediate solution? Personally I don't think so. Basing all decisions off of past fears from an unrelated situation is exactly what the federation did. The yotul are becoming the very thing they sought to destroy: Reactionary and judgemental jerks who ignore the reality of the situation based solely on their own paranoia. IE, they're becoming the feds. Dang roos are becoming isolationist cowards. I thought they were better than that.
mitsos_pr
That is a big conversation, I don't really want to open it. Waiting for chapter 11 to see if my theory about the Krev being human is correct haha
ArchitectOfTears
Yeah I read their attitude same way. Yotul culture was fucked up by the uplift and they feel like Bissem are going to lose part of their technological signature and culture like they did. They probably see humanitys uplift attempt as good natured but ultimately missguided. Not enemy of humans, just disagree with the way it is being handled.
Willy
Honestly? It matters little at this point. Why? "Because the path to hell is paved with good intentions." We won't realise the folly of our actions until we get the result, so I just say sit back and enjoy the causal events from this decision unfold. And i realise it's always that narrow line between Destiny and Choices that progress in life is made, from the predictable nature of Humans to the opposing parties involved with our decisions. *Edit: I like SpacePaladins writing because it highlights the rules of this well, that your actions have real consequences. But it's not shoved in your face and is very subtle.* i’m hyper immersed in this storytelling. 😆
PhycoKrusk
The entire ocean has not died here, either, and the Bissems are around to figure it out. Furthermore, we keep getting told that our ocean is going to die any day, and we know for a fact this is untrue because if it was, NGOs would be out there revitalizing ocean pastures, using the techniques we've developed that we know for a fact work because we've used them in the past and they have always worked. Instead, they're wailing about the oceans dying any day now so please give them money, so I hope you'll understand if I am disinclined to trust any government-backed authority that says demise is just around the next corner, when every single time we've turned the next corner, demise is once again just around the next corner.
Gumcel
I choose to believe this because it’s kinda sweet in a way and I don’t want to be a Yotul hater.
TheDudeAbides
The entire ocean has never died, at least not since humans have been around to "figure it out"
Willy
It's a bit more than good or bad in my opinion. Their attitudes are fuelled by past trauma, the Yotul are as pro-human as you can get but that doesn't mean they agree with all of our interests, at best, I'd say they will become more grey then outright enemies because Humans were the first Xenos to treat them as true friends and allies and that bond can't just be undone after aiding in kicking the Feds ass, Proven their competency in all fields and been realising their potential thanks to humans.
Tazeell
Well glad someone brought up how creepy brain scanning is. I like Naltor. And damn Yotuls sure are killjoys now, i think we've found our main antagonist
PhycoKrusk
Following Nulia's story so far, she left first because she didn't want to watch Slanek's decline, and _then_ Marcel took Slanek and went dark.
PhycoKrusk
Notice all the threats were directed at the UN; everything they said to the Bissems was, "We're not angry at you. None of this is your fault, and it's not fair that you're getting dragged into this."
PhycoKrusk
The negativity is not towards new species; it's towards the UN.
PhycoKrusk
So we graduate from America being the world police to the UN being the galactic police then?
PhycoKrusk
Tassi is a radioastronomer, not an ecologist. She is not going to be up on the latest developments in eco science. Furthermore, Humanity's assistance is conditional: They're only going to help the Bissem as a whole, which at best is going to force them to cobble together a global organization to try and manage things that is never going to work. At worst, solving this problem for the Bissems is going to remove the one challenge that would have made them unite.
Jay Scott Raymond
You should go back an re-read the earlier chapters. Dustin straight up said to Tassi that the Bissem scientists know there is a problem but not the full extent of it. Earth's objectively more advanced tech determined that their marine ecosystem is on the verge of total collapse, and that will lead to mass starvation. Helping them face, or better yet avoid that existential threat is the driving reason for this first contact. This is not even close to the Federation/Yotul situation. The Yotul were not facing an existential threat, the Feds just found them too upity. Probably reminded them of the Venlil.
PhycoKrusk
It's actually Humanity who claims to know better. So far, they haven't done anything except show up and bully Tassi and Naltor into doing things.
Cheesy Power
I do find it ironic that the Yotul have effectively become what they hated- prioritizing their own opinions and desires over those of the Bissem because they “know better” than the primitive, fractured species
paintmelikeyoudoyoursheilas
No. Yotuls, my bois, how could you become this? When everything was going so well and were going full Chad. Hopefully the axur are going in the right direction still with isifs guidance given the absolute specimen he is. Side note is i lo w the idea of emporer penguins waddling around Vienna greeting people which is how I imagine bissems look
PhycoKrusk
Based Yotul continue to be based. Seriously, real talk time. Earth has faced ecological disaster several times, but we're still here. Remember the hole in the ozone layer above the poles? Why don't we talk about that anymore? Because it's gone, that's why. Because we figured out what was causing it, and then we fixed it, and now there is no longer a hole in the ozone layer. Remember how ocean pastures were dying, taking fish and other animals with them? Why don't we talk about that anymore? Because we figured it out. We figured out how to fix it, and then the powers that be immediately shut the project down, because they realized once we fixed the ozone layer that once you fix these problems, you can no longer use them as a weapon to exert control over people. Humanity - and let's be honest, this is very clearly a Human-developed and directed project - is approaching the Bissems with the attitude that they're going to die before they figure out a solution to their problem, even when that was supposed to be the case with Humanity several times only for us to figure out a solution. _That_ is what the Yotul are upset about. "What makes you so special, Humans? How come you trust yourselves to figure out solutions to your problems, but apparently nobody else is smart enough to do so?" They are legitimately concerned that by interfering right now, when unity is not attained, they're just going to create the circumstances where unity becomes impossible, and then what have you done? You've increased the net suffering in Orion, because you were just so damn smart you go fixing everyone's problems for them when they didn't ask. Maybe figuring out how to fix that problem is what would have united them, and now that will never happen. Nice job, idiot.
Gumcel
I mean we’re never actually told if the Yotul’s technological development has surpassed the human’s.
Gumcel
Dustin literally says: “Your oceans are acidifying, and they store fifty times more CO2 than the atmosphere. It’ll start making much of Ivrana uninhabitable to boot. Bissem scientists know this, Tassi; I think you do too.” Followed by Tassi saying: “I know the oceans are dying. The waters are becoming more orange, polluted with algae, than ever. I don’t see what I can do about—” Both humanity and the bissem are fully aware and humanity is coming in to offer them help to prevent an apocalyptic scenario. Something which they are aware of but have been unable to deal with.
PhycoKrusk
Earth has faced eco collapse several times, and you know what happened in the face of it? We figured it out. The Yotul aren't looking at this like they shouldn't intervene; they're looking at this wondering why Humanity seems to think that they're the only ones who can figure it out.
PhycoKrusk
They might not need to; Humanity is approaching the Bissems from the standpoint that they're too dumb to figure out their own solutions, which is especially hypocritical when you consider that Humanity spent almost 200 years figuring out their own solutions (and having them consistently work) before they had first contact.
Willy
nah just extremely paranoid Roo's with a temper.
PhycoKrusk
"No interference, and there would BE no society to mess with!" This assumes that the Bissems aren't smart enough, i.e. "are too primitive", to devise their own solutions.
Greg Gougeon
Uh your leaving out the most important part. Marcel ran out on his kid and disappeared .
PhycoKrusk
The Yotul's attitude right now *is* them being based. Humanity's attitude is that they have to save the Bissems from themselves, because there's no way they're going to figure it out on their own.
mitsos_pr
Yeah I agree with you. The humans are much larger in terms of population, economy and diplomatic support. My concern is the Yotul having a higher rate of technological growth as a society, which could be dangerous. But on the other hand humans are pretty good at designing weapons as well, for better or for worse.
PhycoKrusk
Na. They are correct. Earth's general attitude, insofar as this first contact is concerned, is that the Bissems are too primitive to see what they're doing to their planet, and that they have to be saved from themselves. You know, exactly what the Federation's attitude towards the Yotul was. Given the way that the first contact team has been generally behaving, this is a reasonable thing to think.
Kingarthur
Oh no don't help people. They should pull themselves up by thier bootstraps. Didn't invent bootstraps. Well to damn bad. -future yotul boomer.
Adam Myers
The anger you feel when you best friend is behaving in a reckless self-destructive manner, you are frustrated that they won't listen to your advice, and they are about to get another person roped up in their tragedy, that this is the anger of the Yotul.
Adam Myers
I suspect not. I am thinking it is overprotectiveness. I don't read, "we’d never be admitted to the Coalition" as the Yotul saying, "We won't let you" but as "the galaxy is too cruel for this to happen."
Byron Ritchie
Oh no the Yotul are going to be the bad guys aren’t they?
TheDudeAbides
So the Yotul are of the opinion that it's better to let the entire ecosystem of a planet collapse and leave the Bissem to extinction rather than help them out. So just the most heartless aspects of the prime directive
TheDudeAbides
I doubt humanity shared all of their best tech. If the Yotul get too big for their britches the UN will show off a relatavistic weapon or something
Swan
“Remember Slanek, Doctor Tassi? The Federation captured him and tampered with his short-term memory. But there was an old transcript of him, made from a brain scan their scientists did to help destroy his mind,” Nulia commented. “Tech like this could’ve…restored a version from years ago, if the brain functionality was still there. Marcel—my adoptive father—mentioned trying that, before he went off the grid. It’d be top-secret if they did, I guess. I at least…hope that’s where they vanished to.” Guess we'll see if this is forshadowing, the groundwork for an emotional hammerblow, or one last linchpin to cling onto for those wanting a happy ending for Slanek Great chaptor as always; looking forward to the next one with how much your hyping it up :)
Adam Myers
As I mentioned earlier, what if this is being done for the sake of humanity? I can easily see them seeing the uplift as a threat to both Bissem and humans. That would explain their derision in my mind.
Adam Myers
I don't think they resent humanity. It is possible, but I am seeing more paternalism. "Humanity just doesn't understand how dangerous it is to be a meat eater sapient in the galaxy, despite what was done to them! They need to be more cautious, this uplift of a carnivorous species will be the death of them! Fools! We have to do what we can to oppose this for humanity's own good". I could easily see that. Overcompensating for being treated like a charity case, they now feel in a position of strength, as the unelected protectors of humanity (particularly from themselves).
T___
1. The Bissem sent message to space. They were looking for friends. 2. The Bissem will all die unless someone from the outside helps them. 3. The Yotul know firsthand how much humans appreciate the culture of others. They even brought their "dogs" back! What exactly sounds "Fed" to them? I know they have their trauma. But these are the only people who saw more than "stupid primitive" when looking at them. It will be difficult with the Bissem. They are fractured, but so were humans. The Yotul COULD be helping, instead of shouting from the sidelines. I am disappointed they decided to behave like a backseat driver.
Adam Myers
Food for thought. The Yotul are more skeptical of newer joins to the SC, not skeptical to former fed nonYotuls. My suspicion is that the Yotul have become weirdly paternalistic towards humanity. Most likely they see opposing the uplift as not only being for the good of the Bissem but humanity too. The assholeness is probably born out of a mix of tough love and frustration at humanity "not looking out for its own interest". I can definitely see that behind closed doors, many a Yotul diplomat curses humanity for its foolishness, while swearing to keep humanity from getting shellacked by its own stupidity. If they were simply opposed to the uplift, they wouldn't necessarily have this stance. Simply being former enemies and paranoid doesn't explain it in my eyes. More likely to me, it is because the more recent a SC member admission is, the more anti-human they probably are. This probably doesn't apply to the Bissem as a rule of thumb, but I can definitely see this being the main reason they behave this way. So, assholes yes, understandable, also yes. More relevantly, still very pro-humanity (just not humanity's decisions on the uplift). EDIT:I bet some of the paranoia is on humanity's behalf, albeit unrequited.
Jonathan Cardoso Mota
I mean, those were just random guards. They're probably about to get duper chewed out.
DemonVee
Another bit on the Yotul. They appear to be harbouring resentment for other species, not only towards the Federation, but I'd wager that for Humanity and the SC as well. They are a culture that was humiliated by everyone else in the Orion arm, called useless without the help of other species as their culture was ripped apart. And while Humanities help was genuine, extreme factions that appear after the war would easily see the need to grab Earth's hand as just another stab to their wounded pride. An inferiority complex, mixed with greats amount of power, a very dangerous mix. Hope I'm wrong but this could be an ill omen for the SC.
Bunten44
Also, the SC is already overreaching by basically demanding the Bissem unite as they will not talk to the established Nations themself but only to an entity representing all Bissem. And as we all know nothing is more conducive to stability than forced unity. edit: To those that will inevitably say the SC isn't forcing anything I bet the Bissem will not get the tech they need to not die due to eco collapse before they unite and join the SC.
Gumcel
Yeah embassy guards should not be lobbing threats and waving their guns around.
DemonVee
Oh Yotul, what have you become. Though the signs were already there at the end of NoP, just didn't think they would get that extreme. It's kinda ironic but Humanities involvement with the Technocracy, with the UN granting them so much power in so little of time to fight back against the Federation could be considered another form of uplifting, and this shows a different danger of partaking in something like that carelessly. They have become aggressive, paranoid and arrogant, and have no qualms about using coercion to get their way. Willing to push their weight around their allies seemingly out of cultural trauma. After everything they've gone through it's hard not to feel sympathy for their stance... right until the moment they stop trying to get people out of their own business and they start using it as an excuse to strike out at others. ------------------------------ I never liked the idea of making clones/copies of people to "bring them back to life". Because even if the new entity has your memories, that's not you but a new person. If I died and someone cloned me, I'm sure the new me wouldn't be complaining too much that they were suddenly brought into exitance (Maybe after dealing with the trauma of being a mirror of someone who lived before.) But I personally wouldn't want my memory to be disrespected by being replaced with a new person. All things end, and while it may be hard, it the end it's healthier to accept that.
pogman
Pretty sure those were the guards
PiñaPiloto
Those are some very unprofessional yotul. I completely understand why they're there story-wise, but my logical brain is telling me that the embassies would have better trained staff :/ Lovely chapter, thanks for more sci-fi SP <3
Gumcel
The yotul were a recently uplifted early industrial era species, so they probably have a considerably lower population. Humanity is probably growing faster both in population and economically given their position. I think they’ll be fine. Even if they did build up a military, at most it would be used to hinder humanity’s interests; an outright attack would be insane.
RaphaelFrog
I knew that Yotul were opposing Bissem uplift, but such hostility is uncalled for... Uplift doesn't have to be bad and run like federation did. Also despite words that Dustin is unprofessional... I think that he was a good choice. First contact team that would act like someone has struck a pole up their asses wouldn't do a good impression on overall populace. But first contact team that simply acts as living, breathing beings with emotions is much better choice. Of course politicians will hate them... But sacrifices have to be made. Real ambassadors will arrive later while first contact team has to do for now and warm the populace. I just hope that Yotul won't be that negative towards new species for too long. They should have mentality of "Let's make sure that no uplift goes as ours and make sure that new species feel as comfortable and good as possible" OK, that's enough of my writing. You did an absolutely wonderful job with another chapter of NoP2! I'm looking forward to see more. I'm waiting for Sunday chapter👀
mitsos_pr
I find the Yotul - Human relationship so interesting. The Yotul will certainly try to outpace the Humans militarily. What will humanity do when their friends try to be more powerful than them? Being a powerful friend is easy, being a weak friend is hard.
Charles Michael Santos
I agree with the yotul stance considering their history, they're afraid the SC might do onto the bissems what was done to them by the feds. I mean the bissem weren't the only ones not ready for first contact, the SC was aswell sending untrained and unprofessional (dustin and haliska especially) "diplomats" to initiate first contact which ended up souring relations with the other nations of the bissems especially after that panic attack haliska ended up having while at the feast (partially caused by dustin rambling on about corpses). Looking forward to more species' (especially the yotul's) appearance!!!
Bas Donders
Pretty short-sighted of the Yotul. Just because their uplift was a net negative until humanity came along, doesn't mean that all uplifts necessarily are. Saving a sentient species from extinction by fixing their ecology trumps fears over messing with their society. No interference, and there would BE no society to mess with! In addition to that, they haven't even been uplifted yet. And there is more than one kind of uplift. Maybe humanity just hands them information piecemeal, to stop them from killing themselves while they figure things out and continue their regular path of scientific development. Just a straight out simple minded "uplifts are bad lala I can't hear you" is a stupid position for the Yotul to take. There's so much more nuance to it than that.
Janne Riihinen
Damn the Yotuls gonna be the antagonists?
Mylax Kindflame
Sad to see the Yotul have decided to go and be assholes, although it makes complete sense given their past and species temperament
Paperclip
Are the Yotul going to give up their based status for the entirety of NOP2? Is this the beginning of future tensions? Find out next time on Dragon Ball Z!
Gumcel
“The Selmer general looked stricken. ‘I’m still discomforted by the idea, but I must confess that some of those uses sound interesting to me. What a valuable interrogation asset it must be, as well.’” Naltor: “The thought of someone invading my personal thoughts is a horrifying new reality not thought possible before; can’t wait to use it on prisoners lmao.”
Corporal Chunk
BISSEMSS... bissems... Fuck you Yotuls, fuckin assholes now
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